Re: [Users] Setup Host Network dialog - actions availability [ux][BZ#984737]

From: "Einav Cohen" <ecohen(a)redhat.com&gt; To: "Eldan Hildesheim" <ehildesh(a)redhat.com&gt; Cc: "info" <info(a)eldanet.com&gt;, "users" <users(a)ovirt.org&gt;, jas(a)cs.yorku.ca, "Malini Rao" <mrao(a)redhat.com&gt;, "Lior Vernia" <lvernia(a)redhat.com&gt;, "Karli Sjöberg" <Karli.Sjoberg(a)slu.se&gt;, "René Koch (ovido)" <r.koch(a)ovido.at&gt; Sent: Monday, August 26, 2013 9:48:31 AM Subject: Re: [Users] Setup Host Network dialog - actions availability [ux][BZ#984737] > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eldan Hildesheim" <ehildesh(a)redhat.com&gt; > Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:41:55 AM > > Hi, > The SPACE to the right of the text was made originally only for the > "purpose > network icon" (crown, vm, monitor...) - at one glance the user should > understand the purpose of the network. No other icon (edit) should > interfere > the understanding of this purpose. > 1. Putting a gear instead of a pencil is ok with me - but It shouldn't be > static - it should be shown only in rollover: > It is totally normal to rollover an item and get more options about it and > not having an edit icon next to it. (We don't have an icon inside each line > in the grid as well). again - reminding the original subject of my thread / original pain-point mentioned in the description of BZ#984737: the user had a hard time finding the edit icon in the first place. Replacing a tiny pencil icon with a tiny gear icon (but still displaying it only upon hover) kind-of misses the entire point IMO. a static indication will be helpful in this case. [users: it this is NOT a real pain point - please let us know] Moreover, the fact that the area on the right-hand side of the network-rectangle was made originally only for read-only "purpose" icons is OK, but it doesn't mean that we cannot change that. Alissa made a point about removing the rectangles around the "purpose" icons (see attached) with which I agree - it will make them look less like "buttons" and more like read-only icons. if we will graphically distinguish the gear icon (e.g. separator, border, etc.) so that it wouldn't be mistakenly considered as another "purpose" icon, but as a button, we wouldn't a problem.

> 2. The implementation as it is now is a bit bizarre, you rollover the box > and > you get the EDIT TOOL (pencil) and the TOOLTIP. > Sketch - Option 1 - merges both of the technics together. was there a sketch that you intended to attach? or did you refer to one of the attachments in one of the previous e-mails in the thread? > But in case we don't really need a tool tip as Lior suggests, we can > eliminated the tooltip and go with option 2 (wheel + arrow in rollover) I assume that you mean that gear + arrow will appear upon rollover, not that gear + arrow will always be displayed and the actual available actions (edit, remove) will appear upon hover (which is what I suggested). Which means that in your suggestion - actual available actions (edit, remove) will appear only upon mouse-click (which means that in order to edit a network, two clicks will be required, instead of one today / my suggestion)? > Eldan > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Einav Cohen" <ecohen(a)redhat.com&gt; > To: "users" <users(a)ovirt.org&gt; > Cc: "Lior Vernia" <lvernia(a)redhat.com&gt;, "info" <info(a)eldanet.com&gt;, "Eldan > Hildesheim" <ehildesh(a)redhat.com&gt;, jas(a)cs.yorku.ca, "Karli Sjöberg" > <Karli.Sjoberg(a)slu.se&gt;, "René Koch (ovido)" <r.koch(a)ovido.at&gt;, "Malini Rao" > <mrao(a)redhat.com&gt; > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 9:23:31 PM > Subject: Re: [Users] Setup Host Network dialog - actions availability > [ux][BZ#984737] > > [top posting] > > Many thanks, everyone, for your valuable input - it is highly appreciated! > I would like to do an interim summary of our conclusions / open issues so > far, towards converging to a concrete solution. > > your feedback will be highly appreciated. > > (1) [open issue] actions availability indication: > > (a) always visible (e.g. as a gear icon, see attached > HostSetupNetworks-DropDownMenu.png) > (b) visible only upon hover (see attached > HostSetupNetworks-HoverPopUp.png) > (c) combination (see attached > SetupHostNetworks-StaticAndHoverCombination.png) > > [ignore the exact design details for now (e.g. hover solution contains / > doesn't > contain some network details, gear icon drop-down items panel opens upon > hover / > upon click, etc.] > > I think we all agree that (c) is a bad redundancy; > (a) may somewhat clutter the existing view, however it best resolves the > original pain point mentioned in the BZ/this thread, which is not fully > resolved in solution (b). > according to the input provided in this thread, it seems that most of the > people are in favor of adding the gear icon, which implies that they > support > (a) [I could be wrong, please correct me if I am]. > > (2) [open issue] displaying a details-pop-up upon hover on a logical > network > is needed / not needed. > we received here a couple of opinions that it isn't needed, I would like > to verify that everyone are comfortable with that; also need to keep in > mind that we currently have a details pop-up when hovering on a NIC, and I > assume that we have one for hovering on a Bond - are everyone comfortable > with getting rid of all of these? > > (3) [open issue] actions availability upon click vs. upon hover. > [note: this is not about the indication mentioned in (1) (e.g. gear icon), > but about actually showing the available actions (edit, remove, etc.). > revealing the available actions upon click would mean that two clicks will > be needed in order to edit a logical network, for example, vs. one click > that will be needed in the current state / hover solution. > moreover, if everyone are comfortable with removing the details-pop-up upon > hover (see (2)), then there would be no hover conflicts in that sense. > [even if we decide to keep the details-pop-up - we can include the actions > in it, just like demonstrated in HostSetupNetworks-HoverPopUp.png, so there > will be only one consistent "behavior" upon hovering on the logical network > area] > > my suggestion: > > add a static action indication (e.g. gear icon), and upon hovering on it > (or hovering on the logical network rectangle in general), the actions-pop > -up (which may or may not contain also some network details - again, see > (2)) > will appear [see attached HostSetupNetworks-EinavSuggestion.png] > > * NOTE: Although we are discussing mainly logical networks, the solution > (or > the relevant parts of it) should be applied also to Bonds and NICs within > the same dialog. > > "+1"s / "-1"s / comments / additional suggestions are welcome. > > ---- > Thanks, > Einav > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Karli Sjöberg" <Karli.Sjoberg(a)slu.se&gt; > > To: "Lior Vernia" <lvernia(a)redhat.com&gt; > > Cc: "Einav Cohen" <ecohen(a)redhat.com&gt;, "info" <info(a)eldanet.com&gt;, "Eldan > > Hildesheim" <ehildesh(a)redhat.com&gt;, > > jas(a)cs.yorku.ca, "users" <users(a)ovirt.org&gt; > > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 8:46:52 AM > > Subject: Re: [Users] Setup Host Network dialog - actions availability > > [ux][BZ#984737] > > > > fre 2013-08-23 klockan 15:42 +0300 skrev Lior Vernia: > > > > > > > > On 23/08/13 08:51, Karli Sjöberg wrote: > > > tor 2013-08-22 klockan 20:43 +0300 skrev Lior Vernia: > > >> > > >> On 22/08/13 20:04, Einav Cohen wrote: > > >> > Hi, > > >> > > > >> > This is about attempting to address the difficulty of finding the > > >> > edit-action in > > >> > the Setup Host Network dialog, as documented in "Bug 984737 - > > >> > usability: > > >> > webadmin > > >> > difficulty in assigning client ip, no gateway possible" in bugzilla. > > >> > We have a suggestion from Eldan (see attached > > >> > "HostSetupNetworks-HoverPopUp.png") > > >> > which was described in the BZ (comment #3) and seemed acceptable by > > >> > the > > >> > reporter > > >> > (comment #4), however IIUC - one of the main pain points described > > >> > in > > >> > the BZ was > > >> > the fact that the user could not find the option to Edit the > > >> > connection > > >> > properties > > >> > since he was looking in the wrong place, and needed to hover on the > > >> > correct place, > > >> > in order to find that option. > > >> > So although the idea is somewhat helpful, my concern is that this > > >> > solution is not > > >> > enough (comment #5). > > >> > > > >> > Another proposal from Malini (comment #6) is to add an "actions" > > >> > drop-down menu in > > >> > the form of a small "gear" icon-button - see attached > > >> > "HostSetupNetworks-DropDownMenu.png". > > >> > This proposal addresses my concern, however I have a question about > > >> > another concern > > >> > with this solution: > > >> > would the actions-drop-down menu-items panel be revealed appear upon > > >> > click or upon > > >> > hover? > > >> > > > >> > if it will be upon hover, it might seem weird/be conflicted/be > > >> > somewhat > > >> > confusing > > >> > with the hover functionality that reveals the logical-network > > >> > details > > >> > pop-up. > > >> > > >> If this proposal is accepted (see my comments below about both > > >> proposals), one solution might be to get rid of the network details > > >> tooltip. Most people probably don't use MTU, > > > > > > Just a FYI there Lior; we do:) And when 10GbE becomes available, Jumbo > > > Frames is going to be required to use all that bandwidth. Otherwise you > > > are capped at about half(500MB/s as opposed to 1,2GB/s). > > > > And is it at all helpful to see it in the Host Setup Networks context? > > It is set in the DC context when adding or editing a network, to my > > understanding it doesn't have much to do with a specific host. > > > > > > No I agree, it´s not helpful at all, maybe even destructive. Why allow > > admins > > to mess around with different MTU's on different Hosts for the same > > network. > > Since MTU is set in the switches, the MTU must be the same for all Hosts > > on > > the same network, or one could wreak all kinds of havoc. What I was > > saying > > is not to forget that, for admins, MTU is a big deal, and makes a big > > difference in performance, is all. > > > > > > > > > > I'm guessing the main reason it's there is to give people a shot at > > guessing why their network appears out-of-sync, when it's caused by the > > MTU being configured differently on the host, but I don't think that > > would be easy to figure out anyway. > > > > > > > > /Karli > > > > > >> and the rest is just > > >> explaining the network role icons; so maybe not that useful. > > >> > > >> > if it will be upon click, it means that in order to edit a logical > > >> > network, two > > >> > clicks will be required in order to get to the edit dialog, as > > >> > opposed > > >> > to one click > > >> > in the current state and in Eldan's suggestion. > > >> > maybe having two clicks in order to get to the edit dialog is > > >> > acceptable, however > > >> > there may be some solutions for that: > > >> > > > >> > one possible solution would be to combine both attached suggestions, > > >> > i.e. the actions > > >> > within the hover pop-up, as well as the actions drop-down menu, > > >> > however > > >> > it means that > > >> > there will be some redundancy of the actions availability. > > >> > > >> That sounds bad to me regardless of the other alternatives. > > >> > > >> > another possible solution is to keep only the gear + down-arrow icon > > >> > (or > > >> > maybe only > > >> > the down-arrow icon), without the actual drop-down menu there, just > > >> > in > > >> > order to indicate > > >> > that there are some options available in that area, and have Eldan's > > >> > pop-up appear when > > >> > hovering on that icon (or even on the entire logical-network area, > > >> > as > > >> > happens today with > > >> > the current details pop-up) > > >> > > > >> > thoughts? > > >> > > >> I like the gear icon because it's noticeable and easily recognizable. > > >> However, keep in mind that bonds should also have the same icon to > > >> keep > > >> a consistent design. Now imagine a configuration with several bonds on > > >> the left-hand-side and quite a few networks on the right-hand-side; > > >> I'm > > >> no designer, but it could get cluttered with all those gear icons. > > >> > > >> It MIGHT be preferable to use the other design (tooltip with action > > >> bar) > > >> and risk the odd person not easily finding it (no disrespect intended, > > >> Jason). I have no idea, however, if it's gonna be just the odd person > > >> or > > >> most people. I'd love to hear others' opinions. > > >> > > >> > > > >> > ---- > > >> > Regards, > > >> > Einav > > >> > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Users mailing list > > >> Users@ovirt.org<mailto:Users@ovirt.org> <mailto:Users@ovirt.org> > > >> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Med Vänliga Hälsningar > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Karli Sjöberg > > > Swedish University of Agricultural Sciences > > > Box 7079 (Visiting Address Kronåsvägen 8) > > > S-750 07 Uppsala, Sweden > > > Phone: +46-(0)18-67 15 66 > > > karli.sjoberg@slu.se<mailto:karli.sjoberg@slu.se> > > > <mailto:karli.sjoberg@adm.slu.se> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Med Vänliga Hälsningar > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Karli Sjöberg > > Swedish University of Agricultural Sciences > > Box 7079 (Visiting Address Kronåsvägen 8) > > S-750 07 Uppsala, Sweden > > Phone: +46-(0)18-67 15 66 > > karli.sjoberg@slu.se<mailto:karli.sjoberg@adm.slu.se> > > > _______________________________________________ > Users mailing list > Users(a)ovirt.org > http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users > > >