9:04 p.m.
Hi oVirt community.
I did a short series for tweets @jospanier judging my first time user
experience with several virtualization platforms and was asked by Sandro
Bonazzola to elaborate a bit further than what fits into 140 chars.
I had a specific use case: The small-ish learning lab with only 2-3
nodes and it needs to be free. I also wanted live migration to stay
flexible with my hosts.
I currently use my lab for to run ~10 virtual CSR1000V routers on free
ESXi in addition to some real router hardware. I want to expand the lab
to be able to explore some other technologies as well like network
automation, SDN, infrastructure as code and the likes.
The lineup for the PoC was oVirt, ESXi, Openstack and Proxmox VE.
I my tweets I was referring to a) the install procedure and b) the
operational experience.
Here is what I found. These findings are highly subjective and
debatable. I am aware of that.
Both ESXi and Proxmox VE is trivial to install. You grab the ISO image,
use a tool like Rufus to make an bootable USB stick or use iLO virtual
CD functionality and off you go. Both installers do not ask many
questions and just do their job. After installation ESXi is all ready to
run. Just open the WebGui and start deploying your first node. With
Proxmox VE you get a TUI wizard guiding you though the last steps. After
that the WebGui is ready and you can deploy your first VM immediately.
I found oVirt a bit more involved to install. You have to install the
Engine on one node and then register the other hosts with it. While that
process is easy to handle it is a bit more work. A big thing for me was
that at first glance there did no seem to be a "single node" install. My
fist impression was that I needed a minimum of two servers. Of course
later I learned about the Hosted Engine and the All-In-One install.
Do not get me wrong. First time oVirt installation is still easy to
handle on a quiet afternoon.
Openstack installation compared to that is a PITA nightmare. I tried
both RDO (TripleO) and Fuel for setup but gave up after two days for
both, confused about what I actually need to do for a start. Got some
nodes running with Fuel but was not satisfied. I then followed the
Openstack manual Install Guide. I have a day job, so it took me about 5
days to get through the whole procedure, but a least I understood what
was going on and what I needed to do.
So that was my "first day" experience with those.
Now for the "second day" i.e. operation.
ESXi and Proxmox VE are both very simple to understand. You usually do
not need a manual to find you way around. Deploying a VM is a breeze.
oVirt is pretty simple to understand too. But you have to wrap your head
around the Data Center principle underpinning everything. Its just a bit
more complicated. On one or two occasions while playing around it was
unclear at first why my datacenter was offline and I had to consult the
manual for that. One can immediately feel that multi-tenancy is a big
benefit of oVirt that is not so obvious in ESXi and Proxmox. But it
comes with the price of added complexity.
The new WebGui in the ESXi 6.5 I used is sloooow but some functions are
not available with the vSphere Client Tool any more.
Proxmox and oVirt WebGui are very responsive and "feel" way better. The
Openstack WebGui is also quite nice.
If you want to build a private multi-teneant scale-out cloud OpenStack
is probably your best horse in the stable. But for my purpose it was
just overkill. The process of deploying a simple VM was the most work
from all four tools.
Wrap-up
For the specific use-case (see above) Proxmox VE was the best fit for
me, closely followed by oVirt due to the more involved installation.
ESXi comes in lagging in third place as it does not offer live migration
in the free version and due to the poor WebGui experience I got. Also
you have to pay big bucks to get the same functionality as in the other
three. Openstack is placed at a distant fourth place for this use case.
Hope that was interesting. Do reach out to me on twitter if you have any
further questions or suggestions.
Regards
Johannes
10:11 p.m.
Hi,
First of all, thanks for sharing. It's always good to get feedback,
especially when it's balanced and with specific examples and comparisons.
Secondly, I do believe you have touched on what I believe is a conceptual
difference oVirt has, which translates to a gap in the experience you have
described: when managing 2-3 hosts, it is more intuitive and easier to just
configure each separately (and there's very little to configure anyway, and
the number of hosts is low), then to configure on a higher level (in oVirt
case, data center and cluster level) and apply - who needs either when you
have 2-3 hosts, right?
In a sense, the hyper-converged (gdeploy - see
http://www.ovirt.org/blog/2017/04/up-and-running-with-ovirt-4-1-and-glust...
) provides a good 'day 1' experience I believe - but is indeed limited to
the hyper-converged deployment type. It'd be a good idea to expand it to
the general case of 2-3 hosts, I reckon.
Perhaps we need to go further and somehow hide both data center and cluster
(for X hosts, where X is lower than... 5?) assuming you'd have only a
single DC and a single cluster - and present their options as 'global'?
Once you go above 5 hosts we'll expand the options and display the bigger
hierarchy?
We've had the idea of 'ovirt-lite' years ago, and it never really
materialized - perhaps we should revisit it. I think it's easy
technologically, a bit more challenging to get right the improved user
experience. I can certainly see the use cases of both small labs, remote
offices and proof-of-concept setups.
As for the installation, I would really like to see:
1. Install an OS -or- install oVirt node
2. Go to http://<URL>
3. Installation wizard.
This is exactly (again) what gdeploy provides, as well as hosted-engine -
but we probably need to streamline further more and add regular engine
setup to it.
Thanks again,
Y.
On Sat, May 13, 2017 at 9:04 PM, Johannes Spanier <jospanier(a)web.de> wrote:
Hi oVirt community.
I did a short series for tweets @jospanier judging my first time user
experience with several virtualization platforms and was asked by Sandro
Bonazzola to elaborate a bit further than what fits into 140 chars.
I had a specific use case: The small-ish learning lab with only 2-3 nodes
and it needs to be free. I also wanted live migration to stay flexible with
my hosts.
I currently use my lab for to run ~10 virtual CSR1000V routers on free
ESXi in addition to some real router hardware. I want to expand the lab to
be able to explore some other technologies as well like network automation,
SDN, infrastructure as code and the likes.
The lineup for the PoC was oVirt, ESXi, Openstack and Proxmox VE.
I my tweets I was referring to a) the install procedure and b) the
operational experience.
Here is what I found. These findings are highly subjective and debatable.
I am aware of that.
Both ESXi and Proxmox VE is trivial to install. You grab the ISO image,
use a tool like Rufus to make an bootable USB stick or use iLO virtual CD
functionality and off you go. Both installers do not ask many questions and
just do their job. After installation ESXi is all ready to run. Just open
the WebGui and start deploying your first node. With Proxmox VE you get a
TUI wizard guiding you though the last steps. After that the WebGui is
ready and you can deploy your first VM immediately.
I found oVirt a bit more involved to install. You have to install the
Engine on one node and then register the other hosts with it. While that
process is easy to handle it is a bit more work. A big thing for me was
that at first glance there did no seem to be a "single node" install. My
fist impression was that I needed a minimum of two servers. Of course later
I learned about the Hosted Engine and the All-In-One install.
Do not get me wrong. First time oVirt installation is still easy to handle
on a quiet afternoon.
Openstack installation compared to that is a PITA nightmare. I tried both
RDO (TripleO) and Fuel for setup but gave up after two days for both,
confused about what I actually need to do for a start. Got some nodes
running with Fuel but was not satisfied. I then followed the Openstack
manual Install Guide. I have a day job, so it took me about 5 days to get
through the whole procedure, but a least I understood what was going on and
what I needed to do.
So that was my "first day" experience with those.
Now for the "second day" i.e. operation.
ESXi and Proxmox VE are both very simple to understand. You usually do not
need a manual to find you way around. Deploying a VM is a breeze. oVirt is
pretty simple to understand too. But you have to wrap your head around the
Data Center principle underpinning everything. Its just a bit more
complicated. On one or two occasions while playing around it was unclear at
first why my datacenter was offline and I had to consult the manual for
that. One can immediately feel that multi-tenancy is a big benefit of oVirt
that is not so obvious in ESXi and Proxmox. But it comes with the price of
added complexity.
The new WebGui in the ESXi 6.5 I used is sloooow but some functions are
not available with the vSphere Client Tool any more.
Proxmox and oVirt WebGui are very responsive and "feel" way better. The
Openstack WebGui is also quite nice.
If you want to build a private multi-teneant scale-out cloud OpenStack is
probably your best horse in the stable. But for my purpose it was just
overkill. The process of deploying a simple VM was the most work from all
four tools.
Wrap-up
For the specific use-case (see above) Proxmox VE was the best fit for me,
closely followed by oVirt due to the more involved installation. ESXi comes
in lagging in third place as it does not offer live migration in the free
version and due to the poor WebGui experience I got. Also you have to pay
big bucks to get the same functionality as in the other three. Openstack is
placed at a distant fourth place for this use case.
Hope that was interesting. Do reach out to me on twitter if you have any
further questions or suggestions.
Regards
Johannes
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participants (2)
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Johannes Spanier -
Yaniv Kaul