As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation. Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes: 1. http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/ The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed. Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides. 2. https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install Under the notes for this there is the following passage: “Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password ("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.” Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all. 3. https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states: “After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the engine to be installed on the new VM:” It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit. 4. https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisit... I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL. II. Under “Storage and Networking” there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum. III. Under “Virtual Machines” there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------AB4D4E998350BBE7D998613E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Yeah, its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really like oVirt and what it's doing but the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that seems to be the way of a lot of OpenSource and along with that very few people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of notes and when I get time I'll post them. I know some will say we should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule with work and family and can't do anymore. I've found this mailing list is the best source of information and sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated docs ask here. On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:
As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.
Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:
1.
http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/
The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.
Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.
2.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
Under the notes for this there is the following passage:
Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password ("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.
Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.
3.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:
After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the engine to be installed on the new VM:
It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit.
4.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisit...
I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.
II. Under Storage and Networking there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.
III. Under Virtual Machines there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.
_______________________________________________ Users mailing list Users@ovirt.org http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
--------------AB4D4E998350BBE7D998613E Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit <html> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> <p>Yeah, its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really like oVirt and what it's doing but the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that seems to be the way of a lot of OpenSource and along with that very few people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of notes and when I get time I'll post them. I know some will say we should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule with work and family and can't do anymore.</p> <p>I've found this mailing list is the best source of information and sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated docs ask here.</p> On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:<br> <blockquote cite="mid:CACBeWZOZMUxKAPVWZFvv08pC1zMRJ=B8Hafcubqxn3pJrHaGrw@mail.gmail.com" type="cite"> <div dir="ltr"> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">1. </p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/">http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/</a></a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.<br> </p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">2.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install</a></a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">Under the notes for this there is the following passage:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">3.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install</a></a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>engine to be installed on the new VM:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">4.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisites"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisites">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisites</a></a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%"> I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">II. Under Storage and Networking there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%">III. Under Virtual Machines there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.</p> </div> <br> <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> <br> <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________ Users mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Users@ovirt.org">Users@ovirt.org</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users">http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> --------------AB4D4E998350BBE7D998613E--
On Sep 4, 2016, at 4:26 PM, Brett I. Holcomb <biholcomb@l1049h.com> = wrote: =20 Yeah, its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying = to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot = of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from = VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really like oVirt and what it's doing but =
=20 I've found this mailing list is the best source of information and = sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this = group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated = docs ask here. =20 On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:
As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring =
Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes: 1.=20 = <http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/>http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/ = <http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/> The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one = "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide = for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible = to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would = appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single = machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from = 2012 which has since changed. Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as =
--Apple-Mail=_81423CF4-E4A2-412E-99ED-3524E0207D9B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 The docs do suck but I would challenge you to submit a pull request. = It=92s a pain if you haven=92t done github forks and pull requests. = However, if you do this and it doesn=92t get merged, you have every = right to complain and I=92ll be behind you 100%. I=92ve been in your = shoes and just recently started helping in little bits on some projects. If you can fork the documents, change them to include your notes, I=92d = be happy to hand hold or explain how to do the pull request (think = merging your changes back). you can even email me direct if needed. Tom Gamull the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that = seems to be the way of a lot of OpenSource and along with that very few = people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the = perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really = doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several = hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer = can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks = be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of = notes and when I get time I'll post them. I know some will say we = should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule = with work and family and can't do anymore. problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since = outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a = possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat = Virtualization documentation. they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other = users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.
2. = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install>h= ttps://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install> Under the notes for this there is the following passage: =93Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording = for the admin password ("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine = admin password"), they are asking for the same thing. If you enter = different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.=94 Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely = unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password = a second time at all. 3. = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install>h= ttps://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install> After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states: =93After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the = host and continue. The installer on the host will sync with the = VM and ask for the engine to be installed on the new VM:=94 It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up = at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The = guide should be explicit. 4. = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequi= sites>https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#pre= requisites = <https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequi= sites> I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on = version 24 and 19 is EOL. II. Under =93Storage and Networking=94 there is no mention that oVirt = requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum. III. Under =93Virtual Machines=94 there is no mention of Windows 10, = Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X. =20 =20 _______________________________________________ Users mailing list Users@ovirt.org <mailto:Users@ovirt.org> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users = <http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users> =20
Users mailing list Users@ovirt.org http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
--Apple-Mail=_81423CF4-E4A2-412E-99ED-3524E0207D9B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html = charset=3Dwindows-1252"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" = class=3D"">The docs do suck but I would challenge you to submit a pull = request. It=92s a pain if you haven=92t done github forks and pull = requests. However, if you do this and it doesn=92t get merged, you = have every right to complain and I=92ll be behind you 100%. I=92ve = been in your shoes and just recently started helping in little bits on = some projects.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">If = you can fork the documents, change them to include your notes, I=92d be = happy to hand hold or explain how to do the pull request (think merging = your changes back). you can even email me direct if needed.</div><div = class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Tom Gamull</div><div = class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""> <br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div = class=3D"">On Sep 4, 2016, at 4:26 PM, Brett I. Holcomb <<a = href=3D"mailto:biholcomb@l1049h.com" = class=3D"">biholcomb@l1049h.com</a>> wrote:</div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""> =20 <meta content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" = http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" class=3D""> =20 <div text=3D"#000000" bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF" class=3D""><p class=3D"">Yeah,= its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really = like oVirt and what it's doing but the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that seems to be the way of a lot = of OpenSource and along with that very few people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of notes and when I get time = I'll post them. I know some will say we should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule with work and family and can't do anymore.</p><p class=3D"">I've found this mailing list is the = best source of information and sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated docs ask here.</p> On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:<br class=3D""> <blockquote = cite=3D"mid:CACBeWZOZMUxKAPVWZFvv08pC1zMRJ=3DB8Hafcubqxn3pJrHaGrw@mail.gma= il.com" type=3D"cite" class=3D""> <div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? = Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">1. </p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D""><a = moz-do-not-send=3D"true" href=3D"http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/" = class=3D""></a><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" = href=3D"http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/">http://www.ovirt.org/document= ation/</a></p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure = many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.<br class=3D""> </p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">2.</p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D""><a moz-do-not-send=3D"true" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-in= stall" class=3D""></a><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-in= stall">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-ins= tall</a></p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">Under the notes for this there is the following passage:</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D""><span = class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span" style=3D"white-space:pre"> = </span>=93Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password <span class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span" = style=3D"white-space:pre"> </span>("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same <span class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span" = style=3D"white-space:pre"> </span>thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.=94</p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and = also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.</p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">3.</p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D""><a moz-do-not-send=3D"true" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-in= stall" class=3D""></a><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-in= stall">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-ins= tall</a></p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D"">After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D""><span = class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span" style=3D"white-space:pre"> = </span>=93After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer <span class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span"= style=3D"white-space:pre"> </span>on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the <span = class=3D"gmail-Apple-tab-span" style=3D"white-space:pre"> = </span>engine to be installed on the new VM:=94</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">It is unclear = how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the = VM? The guide should be explicit.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">4.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D""><a = moz-do-not-send=3D"true" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#p= rerequisites" class=3D""></a><a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" = href=3D"https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#p= rerequisites">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-gu= ide/#prerequisites</a></p><p style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" = class=3D""> I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">II. Under = =93Storage and Networking=94 there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.</p><p = style=3D"margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=3D"">III. Under =93Virtual Machines=94 there is no mention of Windows 10, = Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.</p> </div> <br class=3D""> <fieldset class=3D"mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> <br class=3D""> <pre wrap=3D"" = class=3D"">_______________________________________________ Users mailing list <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" = href=3D"mailto:Users@ovirt.org">Users@ovirt.org</a> <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" = href=3D"http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users">http://lists.ovirt.= org/mailman/listinfo/users</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br class=3D""> </div> _______________________________________________<br class=3D"">Users = mailing list<br class=3D""><a href=3D"mailto:Users@ovirt.org" = class=3D"">Users@ovirt.org</a><br = class=3D"">http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users<br = class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br class=3D""></div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_81423CF4-E4A2-412E-99ED-3524E0207D9B--
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5254168353E92DB540CACAD5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks for the information. I haven't done forks or requests with Github. I appreciate the offer and at some point my take you up on it but right now I'm swamped and just can't handle one more thing and it sounds like the fork/pull is not trival. I things slow down I'll try and get back to you on it. Right now it's a LibreOffice document that I made from the notes I did in a text editor while struggling with the install. On 09/04/2016 06:59 PM, Tom Gamull wrote:
The docs do suck but I would challenge you to submit a pull request. Its a pain if you havent done github forks and pull requests. However, if you do this and it doesnt get merged, you have every right to complain and Ill be behind you 100%. Ive been in your shoes and just recently started helping in little bits on some projects.
If you can fork the documents, change them to include your notes, Id be happy to hand hold or explain how to do the pull request (think merging your changes back). you can even email me direct if needed.
Tom Gamull
On Sep 4, 2016, at 4:26 PM, Brett I. Holcomb <biholcomb@l1049h.com <mailto:biholcomb@l1049h.com>> wrote:
Yeah, its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really like oVirt and what it's doing but the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that seems to be the way of a lot of OpenSource and along with that very few people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of notes and when I get time I'll post them. I know some will say we should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule with work and family and can't do anymore.
I've found this mailing list is the best source of information and sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated docs ask here.
On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:
As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.
Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:
1.
http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/
The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.
Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.
2.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
Under the notes for this there is the following passage:
Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password ("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.
Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.
3.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:
After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the engine to be installed on the new VM:
It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit.
4.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisit...
I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.
II. Under Storage and Networking there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.
III. Under Virtual Machines there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.
_______________________________________________ Users mailing list Users@ovirt.org http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
_______________________________________________ Users mailing list Users@ovirt.org <mailto:Users@ovirt.org> http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users
--------------5254168353E92DB540CACAD5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit <html> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> <p>Thanks for the information. I haven't done forks or requests with Github. I appreciate the offer and at some point my take you up on it but right now I'm swamped and just can't handle one more thing and it sounds like the fork/pull is not trival. I things slow down I'll try and get back to you on it. Right now it's a LibreOffice document that I made from the notes I did in a text editor while struggling with the install.</p> <p><br> </p> <br> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 09/04/2016 06:59 PM, Tom Gamull wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote cite="mid:CEB7733D-64BE-46D4-9177-A7C09C4CD0ED@redhat.com" type="cite"> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"> The docs do suck but I would challenge you to submit a pull request. Its a pain if you havent done github forks and pull requests. However, if you do this and it doesnt get merged, you have every right to complain and Ill be behind you 100%. Ive been in your shoes and just recently started helping in little bits on some projects. <div class=""><br class=""> </div> <div class="">If you can fork the documents, change them to include your notes, Id be happy to hand hold or explain how to do the pull request (think merging your changes back). you can even email me direct if needed.</div> <div class=""><br class=""> </div> <div class="">Tom Gamull</div> <div class=""><br class=""> </div> <div class=""> <br class=""> <div> <blockquote type="cite" class=""> <div class="">On Sep 4, 2016, at 4:26 PM, Brett I. Holcomb <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:biholcomb@l1049h.com" class="">biholcomb@l1049h.com</a>> wrote:</div> <br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> <div class=""> <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv="Content-Type" class=""> <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" class=""> <p class="">Yeah, its frustrating for sure as I spent a lot of wasted time trying to figure out what applied, what didn't, what was out of date and a lot of what did apply assumed I already knew parts I needed. I came from VMware and Hyper-V worlds and really like oVirt and what it's doing but the documentation can be frustrating for sure. Unfortunately, that seems to be the way of a lot of OpenSource and along with that very few people like to do documentation and when they do it's from the perspective of someone who already knows the answers so it really doesn't help a brand new person who has no clue. I had to do several hosted engine installs before I got it working (the stupid installer can't recover from an error so it makes you start over) on 3.6 (thanks be to VMware Workstation that let me start over <G>). I took a lot of notes and when I get time I'll post them. I know some will say we should contribute to the docs but I know I already have a full schedule with work and family and can't do anymore.</p> <p class="">I've found this mailing list is the best source of information and sometimes they can link to sources we haven't found. The people in this group are really knowledgeable and helpful so until the do get updated docs ask here.</p> On 09/04/2016 04:14 PM, zero four wrote:<br class=""> <blockquote cite="mid:CACBeWZOZMUxKAPVWZFvv08pC1zMRJ=B8Hafcubqxn3pJrHaGrw@mail.gmail.com" type="cite" class=""> <div dir="ltr" class=""> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">1. </p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/">http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/</a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.<br class=""> </p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">2.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install</a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">Under the notes for this there is the following passage:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">3.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install</a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the <span class="gmail-Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>engine to be installed on the new VM:</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">4.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisites">https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisites</a></p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class=""> I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">II. Under Storage and Networking there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.</p> <p style="margin-bottom:0in;line-height:100%" class="">III. Under Virtual Machines there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.</p> </div> <br class=""> <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> <br class=""> <pre class="" wrap="">_______________________________________________ Users mailing list <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Users@ovirt.org">Users@ovirt.org</a> <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users">http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br class=""> </div> _______________________________________________<br class=""> Users mailing list<br class=""> <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:Users@ovirt.org" class="">Users@ovirt.org</a><br class=""> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users">http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/users</a><br class=""> </div> </blockquote> </div> <br class=""> </div> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> --------------5254168353E92DB540CACAD5--
On Sun, Sep 4, 2016 at 11:14 PM, zero four <zfnoctis@gmail.com> wrote:
As a prospective user of oVirt I have noticed quite a lot of glaring problems with the documentation, is it still being maintained? Since outdated or incomplete documentation is often worse than nothing, a possible solution would be to just link to the official Red Hat Virtualization documentation.
Here are some examples I found after looking for less than 5 minutes:
1.
http://www.ovirt.org/documentation/
The top of this web page has two videos from 2012. The left one "oVirt Open Virtualization Basics -- Single Machine Install" is a guide for the all in one install. This is misleading as it no longer possible to perform an all in one install since 3.6, and in general it would appear the oVirt project does not support deploying oVirt to a single machine. The right video is a guide on creating VMs using the GUI from 2012 which has since changed.
Overall both videos should be removed from the Documentation page as they only confuse and mislead new users. I, and I am sure many other users would greatly appreciate more current video guides.
2.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
Under the notes for this there is the following passage:
“Although hosted-engine and engine-setup use different wording for the admin password ("'admin@internal' user password" vs "Engine admin password"), they are asking for the same thing. If you enter different passwords, the hosted-engine setup will fail.”
Why is the wording different? This appears to be entirely unnecessary, and also confusing as to why it is asking for the password a second time at all.
3.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/how-to/hosted-engine/#fresh-install
After finishing the hosted engine deployment script the guide states:
“After completing the OS installation on the VM, return to the host and continue. The installer on the host will sync with the VM and ask for the engine to be installed on the new VM:”
It is unclear how you are expected to access the VM, is the Web UI up at this point? Do you need to use virsh to connect to the VM? The guide should be explicit.
4.
https://www.ovirt.org/documentation/quickstart/quickstart-guide/#prerequisit...
I. The documentation discusses Fedora 19, Fedora is currently on version 24 and 19 is EOL.
II. Under “Storage and Networking” there is no mention that oVirt requires at least 3 GlusterFS bricks to achieve quorum.
III. Under “Virtual Machines” there is no mention of Windows 10, Fedora past version 20, or RHEL/CentOS 7.X.
Thanks for reporting this, you can open an issues for these: https://github.com/oVirt/ovirt-site/issues Or even send a fix, check this link at the bottom of the page: "Edit this page on GitHub" In the past you could simply edit the page in the wiki, now you have to send a pull request using github, which is little harder. Nir
participants (4)
-
Brett I. Holcomb -
Nir Soffer -
Tom Gamull -
zero four