[Engine-devel] Instance Types Feature

Tue Feb 5 15:16:49 UTC 2013

> So, I had a discussion with Laszlo. Long story short, the question is:
> @Andrew: Is the more basic use case to select the Template or to select the Instance Type + Image? Why?
> 
> We need to decide it because the more basic UC should be in basic view and the less one in advanced (after clicking "show advanced options" button).
>
> The concern is, that the HW is anyhow configured to serve the SW so it, in most cases of private cloud, does not make sense to
> split them. So the user will have to select two combo boxes instead of one with no added value (e.g. RHEL63-instance + RHEL64-image).
>
> I understand that the advantage of having the HW and SW profile separated is that you can update the HW of all VMs created from it. 
> But is this the basic UC or the advanced one?

I have checked with Andy, it seems like this:
the users complains that the "new VM dialog" has far too many options and it is hard to start using it.
After this change, the oVirt will be shipped with preconfigured instance types (e.g. something like small, medium, large etc)
which will pre-fill the dialog, and unless you press the "show advanced options" you won't even know how. It should enhance the 
learning curve of new users. 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
To: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
Sent: Monday, February 4, 2013 12:08:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Engine-devel] Instance Types Feature

So, I had a discussion with Laszlo. Long story short, the question is:
@Andrew: Is the more basic use case to select the Template or to select the Instance Type + Image? Why?

We need to decide it because the more basic UC should be in basic view and the less one in advanced (after clicking "show advanced options" button).

The concern is, that the HW is anyhow configured to serve the SW so it, in most cases of private cloud, does not make sense to
split them. So the user will have to select two combo boxes instead of one with no added value (e.g. RHEL63-instance + RHEL64-image).

I understand that the advantage of having the HW and SW profile separated is that you can update the HW of all VMs created from it. 
But is this the basic UC or the advanced one?

Thank you,
Tomas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
To: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 3:26:42 PM
Subject: Re: [Engine-devel] Instance Types Feature

> A hidden feature is a not existing feature :)
Well, the "hide" was not a correct term :) 

But where would you put it? I see the following options:
1: To the basic screen (but a bit confusing as there will be instance type and image and this dialog should be as simple as possible)
2: To the advanced screen (let's not call it hide but make it an advanced option:) )
3: Do not add it at all (worst case)

I suppose that add it to simple screen and put the Instance type and Image to the advanced one is not really an option as the main point of
this feature is to actually introduce the instance types as a more convenient way of configuring the VM's HW decoupled from SW.

What do you think? Do you see any other ways? I would say that the second possibility is not bad...

Thank you,
Tomas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
To: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:24:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature

A hidden feature is a not existing feature :)

----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
> To: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
> Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 8:30:26 AM
> Subject: Re: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature
> 
> > Of course after introducing the instance type in ovirt, you will
> > still have control over the instance types and create any instance
> > type you like beyond the pre-defined types you have in public
> > cloud, but you
> > will have two things to set: the instance type and the image, which
> > is more administration...
> You will still have the templates - you will be able to choose a
> template which defines both. But it will be "hidden" in advanced
> part of the dialog.
> You are right, the simple way is pretty much inspired by public
> clouds, because they do great job in making the things easy. You
> basically just say you want a small machine and attach a rhel image
> to it.
> Other advantage of separating the HW and SW configuration is that you
> can just change the HW profile (instance type) on which you are
> running, or, if the instance type changes, it gets reflected in all
> machines using this instance type.
> 
> > This is why I think keeping the template as an entity composed out
> > of an image and a instance type would be great.
> yep, it seems we will keep it :) It just will be hidden in the
> advanced options (e.g. one more click). Sounds reasonable?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
> To: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
> Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 12:16:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature
> 
> hi,
> 
> This is what I thought of:
> 
> In public clouds it is common to have pre-defined instance types e.g.
> amazon small/medium/large/x-large instance, and this is what
> customers get even if they don't like it. I guess this helps Amazon
> a lot to simplify the decision logic for vm scheduling and pricing.
> 
> In a private cloud, you choose the resources your application needs,
> therefore you can choose just as much as you need.
> 
> Of course after introducing the instance type in ovirt, you will
> still have control over the instance types and create any instance
> type you like beyond the pre-defined types you have in public cloud,
> but you will have two things to set: the instance type and the
> image, which is more administration than just working with
> templates, while most of the cases the templates were enough: you
> created both the OS image and the virtual hardware profile it is
> running on. For another image and another workload, I would most
> likely want to create another one that just fits the needs.
> 
> This is why I think keeping the template as an entity composed out of
> an image and a instance type would be great.
> 
> Laszlo
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
> > To: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
> > Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
> > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2013 1:32:20 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature
> > 
> > Hi Laszlo,
> > 
> > it is not useful just for public clouds - it can be pretty useful
> > for
> > private as well. But to keep the previous way, it could be done
> > this
> > way:
> > - on the advanced screen (after clicking "show advanced options"
> > you
> > can specify the template)
> > - by default you pick on basic view the instance type (e.g. HW
> > profile) and the Image (e.g. disk with some metadata such as OS
> > type). But, you can select custom instance type (equivalent to
> >  blank template) and no Image. In this case the template appears
> > also on basic view and you can select it.
> > 
> > What do you think?
> > 
> > Tomas
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Laszlo Hornyak" <lhornyak at redhat.com>
> > To: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
> > Cc: engine-devel at ovirt.org
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 7:16:32 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature
> > 
> > Hi Tomas,
> > 
> > I like the idea in general, but for me the instance types looks
> > like
> > a feature that is typical in public clouds, while in private clouds
> > it looks more like a cool extra feature for special cases.
> > Therefore
> > in my opinion it would be great to keep the old template solution
> > as
> > well to keep it simple for most users. A template could be an
> > instance type and an image together. Only the description overlap,
> > and that could be solved.
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Laszlo
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Tomas Jelinek" <tjelinek at redhat.com>
> > > To: engine-devel at ovirt.org
> > > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 3:09:51 PM
> > > Subject: [Engine-devel]  Instance Types Feature
> > > 
> > > Hi All,
> > > 
> > > this is the proposed new feature called instance types:
> > > http://www.ovirt.org/Features/Instance_Types
> > > 
> > > Long story short - it should basically split the VM template
> > > into:
> > > - "hardware profile" called instance types
> > > - "software profile" called image
> > > 
> > > This should enable to do something like: Create a new "small" VM
> > > and
> > > attach a disk with "RHEL + Postgres" installed.
> > > 
> > > Any comments are more than welcome!
> > > 
> > > Tomas
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Engine-devel mailing list
> > > Engine-devel at ovirt.org
> > > http://lists.ovirt.org/mailman/listinfo/engine-devel
> > > 
> > 
> 
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